Stalin vs Hitler (general commentary)

[HurriKANE]

My opinion as to why Stalin is less hated than Hitler has nothing to do with Stalin being "less evil."

Stalin was of course "cruel." If the Historians are correct (Russian nationalists and Marxists deny this), he intentionally starved million Ukranians to death (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor).

(a side note. notice how everyone "without a doubt" claims an exact number of Jews killed, but allows debate over the number of Serbs killed, Ukrainians killed, Armenians killed, Gypsies killed etc.)

He butchered Polish people in the Katyn massacre (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre). He supported the invasion of Poland by Hitler and invaded the other side of Poland himself.

He mass deported people in Chechnya (http://www.globalissues.org/article/100/crisis-in-chechnya) to Siberia.

Stalin was also willing to collaborate with Hitler. Hitler probably wouldn't have existed without Stalin existing. Hitler could not have blamed Jews for Communist crimes if there were no Communist crimes. Stalin is a Georgian of course but many Soviets were Jews.

If Historians are accurate, Hitler murdered 6,000,000 Jews, helped Ustase murder a bunch of Serbs and purposely motivated Poles and Ukrainians to murder each other (while joining in). He started the world war too.

So why is Hitler seen more negatively than Stalin? I think the answer is that Stalin was an architect who took a third world country and made it into a beautiful industrial powerhouse! Stalin was an engineer of civilization, but Hitler made what, the Autobahn? Also Stalin brought his country victory and pride whereas Hitler brought them defeat and shame.

You can say Stalin wasn't a Russian but then Hitler wasn't a German, although Hitler was at least Germanic racially.

So that is why Stalin is seen more positively. He's as evil, but at least he wasn't a total fuckup. He at least accomplished things. As did Pol Pot. If Pol Pot did not exist, Cambodia would not exist today. Vietnam would have taken over Cambodia, the way Yugoslavia took over the Balkans and Hitler took over Austria.

[apocales]

.

[Fugasnaya]

I think Stalin is seen very differently by different people the world over. First though, I must remind you that as always, you are generalizing way too much. "Marxism" today is dominated by Trotskyists and they do NOT like Uncle Joe. He caved in the skull of their grand Yid messiah! Only National Bolsheviks, Strasserites, Asiatic and to a lesser extent Latin American socialists/communists have any reverence left for Stalin.

Among bourgeois reactionaries today I would say Stalin is considered more evil than Hitler. Even Jews remember Stalin's anti-Zionist purges with more genuine pain than they do the so-called Holocaust! After all, capitalist forces saved a lot of SS men from the rope and recruited them into the NATO war machine to fight the reds. Post-Putsch Nazism and Fascism served as an inspiration for many anti-communist regimes set up by western intelligence services. Our Allied "hatred" of Hitler is a form of collective masturbation, the capitalist west reveres reactionary militarism and the destruction of the Axis powers served as sacrificial megaritual that resulted in the genesis of the Zionist world order as we see it today.

In all honesty how can you say Hitler started the World War? I think Britain and France deserve the blame for rushing to the defense of Poland.

Ever hear of the Treaty of Versailles? :nono:

[HurriKANE]

Poland did anger a lot of people with its territorial imperialism (in the Ukraine too), but it's ridiculous to say that this was Hitler's motivation for attacking Poland.

He attacked Poland because it was geographically located on the path to Russia. Kind of take out all the Slavs/Jews in one path to the Bolsheviks land.

His anti-slav ideology was more territorial. He liked Balkan Slavs.

Trotskyites do not like Stalin but they still in general prefer Stalin to Hitler. I'd say Stalin has more support than you are giving him credit for, though.

[Edmonds Fitzgerald]

Hitler attacked poland because they're a nation of cocksuckers.

[XCaliber]

He attacked Poland because it was geographically located on the path to Russia. Kind of take out all the Slavs/Jews in one path to the Bolsheviks land.

His anti-slav ideology was more territorial. He liked Balkan Slavs.

True, Germans had a rivalry with Slavs a thousand years before Hitler was born. Communism was just an excuse to attack Russia for territorial objectives. Not to say that Hitler didn't hate pinkos, but it was like killing two birds with one stone; "destroy Communism and take some land from the Slavs for German settlers while we're at it".

[EinsatzGrenadier]

So that is why Stalin is seen more positively. He's as evil, but at least he wasn't a total fuckup. He at least accomplished things. As did Pol Pot. If Pol Pot did not exist, Cambodia would not exist today. Vietnam would have taken over Cambodia, the way Yugoslavia took over the Balkans and Hitler took over Austria.

Stalin is seen more positively because he helped build the jew world order we live in. He was a very useful tool, and his contributions in stamping out the enemies of Jews will never be forgotten. Stalin even declared anti-Semitism to be punishable by death.

I do consider Stalin to be a great man, and so did Hitler for that matter. Hitler always liked Stalin more than any of the western leaders, but he hated the Russian people(which Stalin did too frankly). Particularly he hated them living west of the Urals.

As for Pol Pot, who cares? What's Cambodia? They would have been better off if the Vietnamese took over.

Even Jews remember Stalin's anti-Zionist purges with more genuine pain than they do the so-called Holocaust!

That pain is because their boy turned on them, Ol' Joe was just too paranoid. Of course as Solzhenitsyn said, the only thing Stalin ever failed at was his Jewish pogrom. He killed everyone else, but when he started to move against the Jew, the true masters of the USSR had him removed.

Just as Hitler was obsessed with Stalin, Stalin was with Hitler. He wanted to know everything about him, and he greatly admired him. To Stalin's credit, Stalin had always tried to work together with Hitler. He signed the pact with him, and he wanted to make a peace deal with Germany(that would have left the Nazi Party in power) numerous times during the war. He never even wanted to take over and occupy Germany. It's possible Stalin's post-war anti-Semitic paranoia was partly inspired by the Nazis.

Certainly Stalin was always known to have been a friend of the Jew. He was one of the first backers of Israel, supporting the Zionist terrorists even when they were fighting the Brits. Stalin was one of the first to recognize the state of Israel too.

Hitler's idea was better: send them to Madagascar. He knew that Palestine would have given them a spiritual center to spread their tentacles.

[HurriKANE]

At least you admit that Hitler was not some russophile. I hate WNs who just won't face history.

I'm appalled by how idiotic some people are. They can't understand how a Irish and English or Pole and German person would fight, and think all Europeans are unified. I've got news for you, a Greek or Roman person has more in common with a Maltese or Arab than he/she does with a Russian. I have a natural revulsion for American WNs. They are a disgusting people.

I'm actually giving you credit for recognizing the realities of national conflict, in contrast to wns who base all their views off of psuedoscience.

[XCaliber]

At least you admit that Hitler was not some russophile. I hate WNs who just won't face history.

I'm appalled by how idiotic some people are. They can't understand how a Irish and English or Pole and German person would fight, and think all Europeans are unified. I've got news for you, a Greek or Roman person has more in common with a Maltese or Arab than he/she does with a Russian. I have a natural revulsion for American WNs. They are a disgusting people.

I'm actually giving you credit for recognizing the realities of national conflict, in contrast to wns who base all their views off of psuedoscience.

The thing that American white nationalists don't understand, is that tribal/ethnic conflict and intra-racial racism have been a BIGGER problem than inter-racial racism throughout history.

If you study Oriental culture, you will notice that the different Oriental peoples hate eachother even more than they hate white, black, or brown people. (East) Asians may see Euros, Africans and Middle Easterners as more foreign, and not integrable into their cultures. But they hate us not nearly as much as they hate eachother, even though they can absorb eachother due to being of a similar racial stock. An example is the Manchurians who are now practically extinct as a people because the Chinese dominated them, mixed with them, and ultimately absorbed them. And the Chinese are moving to Sinofy other Oriental ethnic groups, like Tibetans and Mongolians.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdV-wJyE3xE

And Hitler, despite being a racist who looked down upon non-whites, did not really hate them as much as he hated his arch enemies in Europe, like Russians, Poles, Jews (Jews aren't white but some would pass them off as such). A lot of the time, Asians, Indians and Middle Easterners, especially the ones who haven't been westernized or white washed, have suprisingly positive things to say about the man. Whereas a lot of White people curse his name when they hear it.

[HurriKANE]

A lot of Arabs like Hitler. I was looking through random Saudi Arabian pictures on facebook and saw a Hitler picture as an avatar!

An analogy is that the Ottoman Turks probably looked down upon negroids. But Armenians were still "the main" enemy, not negroids. The Egyptians looks down upon Negroids. But their main enemy was the Jewish slaves who escaped. The enemy is often a nationality of similar blood. Croats and Serbs are another good example.

White nationalists don't understand this. They think Hitler was a kkk member or something, because he made race conscious statements and liked to talk about Jews.

I disagree about Jews being non-whites, but only because I think whites, even Swedish whites, are linked to the middle east, Jew or Gentile. The white race derives from paleothic and neolithic middle eastern migrations, and retroactive migrations from India. Jews are "half assimilated."

[O'Zebedee]

I'm appalled by how idiotic some people are.

It's a damn shame, isn't it? The way they demonize Pol Pot, misunderstand Hitler's feelings re: the Slavs, and fail to grasp the genius of ICP and Esham.

Sheep, I tell you!

[Fugasnaya]

Poland did anger a lot of people with its territorial imperialism (in the Ukraine too), but it's ridiculous to say that this was Hitler's motivation for attacking Poland.

He attacked Poland because it was geographically located on the path to Russia. Kind of take out all the Slavs/Jews in one path to the Bolsheviks land.

His anti-slav ideology was more territorial. He liked Balkan Slavs.

Trotskyites do not like Stalin but they still in general prefer Stalin to Hitler. I'd say Stalin has more support than you are giving him credit for, though.

Germany attacked Poland because Poland was unjustly holding German territory granted to it under Versailles. Hitler was a hypocrite when it came to his feelings on Slavs - one of his own heroes Richard Wagner was a close associate of Mikhail Bakunin and participated in the Dresden Uprising with him in May of 1848.

Whatever pre-existing anti-Slavic sentiment Hitler had was further encouraged by the SS and the factions behind the reactionary wing of the Nazi party. In the case of Vlasov's army, Hitler was against the idea and Himmler who was also highly anti-Slav had to talk him into it. Vlasov's men would ultimately turn on the SS to defend the city of Prague from them after the tide turned against Germany.

Hitler's attitude toward Slavs is what cost him the war. Stalin had created an alternative to Israel called Birobidzhan, he expected Jews to flock to both places. He allowed the Israelis to bring in arms from Czechoslovakia that would be reverse engineered into things like the modern Uzi. But once he realized that the Jews were not genuine socialists and that many of them were only concerned with the advancement of their own kind, he put down prominent Jews like dogs and excised them from public life in the Soviet Union. They never fully recovered in Russia, but they have thrived in the west, all thanks to Hitler's "final" solution to the Jews in Europe. Now they have Palestine just for themselves and enough atomic firepower to intimidate pretty much anyone.

[EinsatzGrenadier]

Whatever pre-existing anti-Slavic sentiment Hitler had was further encouraged by the SS and the factions behind the reactionary wing of the Nazi party. In the case of Vlasov's army, Hitler was against the idea and Himmler who was also highly anti-Slav had to talk him into it. Vlasov's men would ultimately turn on the SS to defend the city of Prague from them after the tide turned against Germany.

Hitler hated Vlasov not because he was a Slav but because he was a traitor. He said, "What a pig this Vlasov must be! Stalin gave him everything." Hitler already had to deal with the reactionary traitors of the German army, he didn't want to encourage others worldwide. Hitler was right to not trust them because as you illustrated, they were genuinely prone to betrayal. Those who fought the SS in Prague certainly deserved the noose given to them by their new-found "allies."

Hitler's attitude toward Slavs is what cost him the war.

Hitler's attitude towards Slavs is what started the war.

once he realized that the Jews were not genuine socialists and that many of them were only concerned with the advancement of their own kind, he put down prominent Jews like dogs and excised them from public life in the Soviet Union. They never fully recovered in Russia, but they have thrived in the west, all thanks to Hitler's "final" solution to the Jews in Europe. Now they have Palestine just for themselves and enough atomic firepower to intimidate pretty much anyone.

Stalin should have known better from the start. It took him that long to realize Jews are more concerned with advancing their own kind than with genuine socialism? I could have told you that when I was 16.

To say the Jews never recovered in the Soviet Union is crazy. Stalin didn't even succeed in putting down any Jews. He died in the process! The Jews weren't about to let their puppet do anything like that, so he ate some poison. Russian soldiers pissed on his corpse, and his legacy was thrown in the garbage.

[HurriKANE]

I suppose a pro-Slav anti-Semite can still attack Russia, with the attitude that he/she is liberating Slavs from Bolshevism.

But this was not Hitler. Hitler hated all Northeastern Europeans, whether Jew or Gentile. His attitude was that Slavs were inferior and thus "allowed themselves to be controlled" by Jews.

[Fugasnaya]

Hitler hated Vlasov not because he was a Slav but because he was a traitor. He said, "What a pig this Vlasov must be! Stalin gave him everything." Hitler already had to deal with the reactionary traitors of the German army, he didn't want to encourage others worldwide. Hitler was right to not trust them because as you illustrated, they were genuinely prone to betrayal. Those who fought the SS in Prague certainly deserved the noose given to them by their new-found "allies."

The way I hear the story told, the SS was committing atrocities left and right and Vlasov's army would not stand by and let them raze Prague when the war was already lost. They had a different opinion about helping the Nazis kill Jews in Krakow. Vlasov's men had to immediately flee Prague after the battle because the Communists there wanted to kill them. Most didn't get very far.


Stalin should have known better from the start. It took him that long to realize Jews are more concerned with advancing their own kind than with genuine socialism? I could have told you that when I was 16.

To say the Jews never recovered in the Soviet Union is crazy. Stalin didn't even succeed in putting down any Jews. He died in the process! The Jews weren't about to let their puppet do anything like that, so he ate some poison. Russian soldiers pissed on his corpse, and his legacy was thrown in the garbage.

Russian Jews were often highly assimilated and many made great sacrifices during the Bolshevik revolution. It was the first time Jews and gentiles had really come together to overthrow a tyrannical system in that part of the world and it resulted in an even greater degree of Jewish assimilation into the gentile masses. This was the opposite of what Zionism wanted, but it was considered a price worth paying for the death of the old Russia which had for centuries kept the Jew under control, to the point that people lost touch with what the Jew really was until Bolshevism emerged. Jewry did not have to be physically destroyed for it to be permanently hobbled in Russia. After Stalin fell, Zionist sympathizers guided the fate of the Soviet Union to an extent, but as the cold war came to an end Stalinesque anti-Zionist tendencies rose rapidly and solidified with the rise of Vladimir Putin, a former KGB officer whose family had close ties to Stalin. After Communism fell, western backed Jews had rushed to buy up all the assets of the state and privatize them. Putin ended this with extreme prejudice.

The Jews rule over us Americans, they do not rule over Russians. Khazaria was the homeland of these so-called "Jews" and they have a natural place in the Russian melting pot - they have no natural place in western Europe or the Americas. Zionism relieved Russia of negative Jewish influence to a large extent, leaving it highly concentrated in the extreme upper class where it was easy for Putin to excise and control.

[HurriKANE]

Benito Mussolini, who lead the only real fascist country, was anti-Slav but not anti-Jew. In their view, the Jewish takeover of Bolshevism reflected more negatively on Slavs than it did on Jews.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Slavism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rab_concentration_camp

JEWS WERE TREATED BETTER THAN CROATS AND SLOVENIANS IN MUSSOLINI'S CONCENTRATION CAMPS! Mussolini liked Jews!

[HurriKANE]

Studying the nazis and communists, I am learning how effective a military chain of command can be.

As soon as the war against Bolsehvism starts, all of Hitler's allies start imitating him with "racial laws" against Jews (although most also hid "good Jews"). Likewise when Stalin wants to shut down the media, he can do it in a second.

On the other hand, "anti-semitic" movements like the iron guard which are not tied to the military were ineffective and lost power to the monarchy.

So if you want to change politics, all you need is a good military. MIGHT MAKES RIGHT!

[XCaliber]

Not true, Dennis. Mussolini hated Jews.

"Those bloody Jews, they should be destroyed ... I'll build an island and put them all there... They don't even have any gratitude, recognition, not even a letter of thanks... They say we need them, their money, their help."

There is also a fascist symbol that was used in Italy that I was searching for, but I couldn't find it. It basically was a bunch of snakes in the pattern of the star of david. It was being grabbed in a choking fashion, and there was some Italian writing below it which said "Crush the Jews" or something like that.

Fascist Italy was very anti-semitic, maybe not on the level of Nazi Germany, but it was alive and well.

[apocales]

Jews simply have been hated by everyone throughout history, only until recently have people been kike lickers.

[HurriKANE]

Apocoles, it is probably true that at the time of the attempted takeover of Bolshevism by Jews, everyone was a bit concerned but anti-semitism varies in degrees and gradients. Don't count Americans into this, because they are too stupid to think in such terms. It appears that many Jews saw Bolshevism as a means to conquer the world and not as a philosophy.

But Stalin was weary of it, Churchill was weary of it, various nationalists in eastern europe were weary of it. That said, there are different degrees. Hitler was unique in that he targeted people (allegedly) on the SOLE basis of having Jewish ancestry. His axis allies in general placated him, but tried to save individual "nationalist Jews" behind his back. This includes Italians, Romanians, Ukranians, Poles while occupied by Nazis, even Croats. They all knew that Bolshevism and Jews were intertwined, but Hitler was allegedly unique in his desire to wipe out every Jew. In every other movement, from Stalin to Churchill to Italy, you'll find that while Jews may choose to fight against the regime, the regime would prefer to have Jewish support if possible.

Again, Stalin and Churchill also expressed concern over Jewish behavior at the time, as did Henry Ford. But people differed in the extent that they wished to fight Jewish control of Bolshevism, the extent that they were Bolsheviks themselves, the extent to which they wanted to insure that "good Jews" were protected, and their tactics. Allegedly.

[brother number three]

vietnam did take over cambodia in 1979. cambodia exists in spite of brother number one, not because of him.