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View Full Version : Neanderthal genes 'survive in us'


Breckinridge Elkins
05-07-2010, 04:15 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/spl/hi/sci_nat/10/neanderthal/img/neanderthals_786.gif

By Paul Rincon
Science reporter, BBC News



Many people alive today possess some Neanderthal ancestry, according to a landmark scientific study.

The finding has surprised many experts, as previous genetic evidence suggested the Neanderthals made little or no contribution to our inheritance.

The result comes from analysis of the Neanderthal genome - the "instruction manual" describing how these ancient humans were put together.

Between 1% and 4% of the Eurasian human genome seems to come from Neanderthals.

But the study confirms living humans overwhelmingly trace their ancestry to a small population of Africans who later spread out across the world. [Neanderthals] are not totally extinct, in some of us they live on - a little bit
Professor Svante Paabo
Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology


The most widely-accepted theory of modern human origins - known as Out of Africa - holds that the ancestors of living humans (Homo sapiens) originated in Africa some 200,000 years ago.

A relatively small group of people then left the continent to populate the rest of the world between 50,000 and 60,000 years ago.

While the Neanderthal genetic contribution - found in people from Europe, Asia and Oceania - appears to be small, this figure is higher than previous genetic analyses have suggested.

"They are not totally extinct. In some of us they live on, a little bit," said Professor Svante Paabo, from the Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology in Leipzig, Germany.

Professor Chris Stringer, research leader in human origins at London's Natural History Museum, is one of the architects of the Out of Africa theory. He told BBC News: "In some ways [the study] confirms what we already knew, in that the Neanderthals look like a separate line.

"But, of course, the really surprising thing for many of us is the implication that there has been some interbreeding between Neanderthals and modern humans in the past."

Science Explained: What is a genome?

John Hawks, assistant professor of anthropology at the University of Wisconsin-Madison in the US, told BBC News: "They're us. We're them.

"It seemed like it was likely to be possible, but I am surprised by the amount. I really was not expecting it to be as high as 4%," he said of the genetic contribution from Neanderthals.

The sequencing of the Neanderthal genome is a landmark scientific achievement, the product of a four-year-long effort led from Germany's Max Planck Institute but involving many other universities around the world.

The project makes use of efficient "high-throughput" technology which allows many genetic sequences to be processed at the same time.

The draft Neanderthal sequence contains DNA extracted from the bones of three different Neanderthals found at Vindija Cave in Croatia.

Retrieving good quality genetic material from remains tens of thousands of years old presented many hurdles which had to be overcome.

The samples almost always contained only a small amount of Neanderthal DNA amid vast quantities of DNA from bacteria and fungi that colonised the remains after death.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/47791000/jpg/_47791931_paabo2_mpg_466.jpg

Svante Paabo (pictured here with a Neanderthal skull) led the research effort


The Neanderthal DNA itself had broken down into very short segments and had changed chemically. Luckily, the chemical changes were of a regular nature, allowing the researchers to write software that corrected for them.

Writing in Science journal, the researchers describe how they compared this draft sequence with the genomes of modern people from around the globe.

"The comparison of these two genetic sequences enables us to find out where our genome differs from that of our closest relative," said Professor Paabo. Those things that made the Neanderthals apparent to us as a population - those things didn't work
Dr John Hawks
University of Wisconsin-Madison


The results show that the genomes of non-Africans (from Europe, China and New Guinea) are closer to the Neanderthal sequence than are those from Africa.

The most likely explanation, say the researchers, is that there was limited mating, or "gene flow", between Neanderthals and the ancestors of present-day Eurasians.

This must have taken place just as people were leaving Africa, while they were still part of one pioneering population. This mixing could have taken place either in North Africa, the Levant or the Arabian Peninsula, say the researchers.

The Out of Africa theory contends that modern humans replaced local "archaic" populations like the Neanderthals.

But there are several variations on this idea. The most conservative model proposes that this replacement took place with no interbreeding between modern humans and Neanderthals.

Unique features

Another version allows for a degree of assimilation, or absorption, of other human types into the Homo sapiens gene pool.

The latest research strongly supports the Out of Africa theory, but it falsifies the most conservative version of events.

The team also identified more than 70 gene changes that were unique to modern humans. These genes are implicated in physiology, the development of the brain, skin and bone.

The researchers also looked for signs of "selective sweeps" - strong natural selection acting to boost traits in modern humans. They found 212 regions where positive selection may have been taking place.

The scientists are interested in discovering genes that distinguish modern humans from Neanderthals because they may have given our evolutionary line certain advantages over the course of evolution.

The most obvious differences were in physique: the muscular, stocky frames of Neanderthals contrast sharply with those of our ancestors. But it is likely there were also more subtle differences, in behaviour, for example.

Dr Hawks commented that the amount of Neanderthal DNA in our genomes seemed high: "What it means is that any traits [Neanderthals] had that might have been useful in later populations should still be here.

"So when we see that their anatomies are gone, this isn't just chance. Those things that made the Neanderthals apparent to us as a population - those things didn't work. They're gone because they didn't work in the context of our population."

Researchers had previously thought Europe was the region where Neanderthals and modern humans were most likely to have exchanged genes. The two human types overlapped here for some 10,000 years.

The authors of the paper in Science do not rule out some interbreeding in Europe, but say it was not possible to detect this with present scientific methods.

Paul.Rincon-INTERNET@bbc.co.uk

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8660940.stm

Johnson
05-07-2010, 11:04 PM
Turns out they were just dead Croatians.

XCaliber
05-07-2010, 11:48 PM
It depends how far removed neanderthals were from our species. Two species from the same genus can sometimes produce a sterile infant. Lions and tigers can produce ligers and tigons, but the new mongrel offspring cannot produce any babies of their own, even with other ligers and tigons. So neanderthals must have been pretty close to us in order for their genes to have survived in our gene pool.

WFHermans
05-08-2010, 01:22 AM
Between 1% and 4% of the Eurasian human genome seems to come from Neanderthals.

Interesting that niggers don't have Homo sapiens neanderthalensis ancestry.

Between 1% and 4% of the Eurasian human genome seems to come from Neanderthals. Neanderthals had a larger brainmass than modern humans. Their 1-4% genetic contribution could have been important, even decisive in elevating our ancestors from the negroid-chimp beasts.

Zed
05-08-2010, 01:27 AM
Interesting that niggers don't have Homo sapiens neanderthalensis ancestry.

Neanderthals had a larger brainmass than modern humans. Their 1-4% genetic contribution could have been important, even decisive in elevating our ancestors from the negroid-chimp beasts.

Yes, indeed. :rockout:

Kriger
05-08-2010, 04:50 AM
This makes very little sense. For one thing, who is being called a homo sapien? Certainly not the cro magnon. Scientifically, homo sapiens have been dated to 200,000 years ago in Africa. Proto-neanderthal appeared in Europe some 600,000 to 350,000 years ago. Cro-magnon dated to appearing roughly 35,000 years ago. Last known site of Neanderthal settlement being Rock of Gibralter some 24,000 years ago.

Now if the scientists have indeed found a mixing of DNA from homo sapiens and Neanderthal, this is one thing. The Cro-magnon..precursors of homo sapiens sapiens..have been shown to be a separate species from Neanderthal. And to date, as far as I know, no mixing of Neanderthal and Cro-magnon DNA has occured despite the fact that their cultures overlapped and they lived within the same areas as each other. There also has been no archaeological evidence that they warred with each other. All indications have been that they peacefully co-existed with each other and for some reason or reasons Neanderthal slowly died out.

FIPS
05-08-2010, 06:03 AM
.

As I perhaps did not make sufficiently clear yesterday http://stumbleinn.net/forum/showthread.php?t=18971, there is no evidence eurasians obtained any positive genetic benefits from Neanders. Our superiority to niggers has to do with:

1) our ability to assimilate fatty acids from milk products long after weaning, which allows the brain to continue to develop fold complexity through white adolescence, plus

2) better abilities to maintain desirable salt ratios in the blood going to the brain by being able to exchange salts through white skin easier than through melanin-thickened and heavily greased black skin.

These genetic changes have occurred SINCE the Neaders stopped evolving, and stopped "contributing".

.

Zed
05-08-2010, 06:07 AM
.

As I perhaps did not make sufficiently clear yesterday http://stumbleinn.net/forum/showthread.php?t=18971, there is no evidence eurasians obtained any positive genetic benefits from Neanders. Our superiority to niggers has to do with:

1) our ability to assimilate fats from milk products long after weaning, which allows the brain to continue to develop fold complexity through white adolescence, plus

2) better abilities to maintain desirable salt ratios in the blood going to the brain by being able to exchange salts through white skin easier than through melanin-thickened and heavily greased black skin.

These genetic changes have occurred SINCE the Neaders stopped evolving, and stopped "contributing".

.

Do you have some more information on this? What's this exchanging salts business?

FIPS
05-08-2010, 06:25 AM
Do you have some more information on this? What's this exchanging salts business?
.

The body (and the brain in particular) is very sensitive to the ratios of different metal salts in the blood, including potassium, calcium, sodium, and magnesium. If you have an additional way of disposing of one or the other, when you have too much of that one, you will be greatly benefitted in blood and brain chemistry.

.

Zed
05-08-2010, 06:26 AM
Like sweating it out?

FIPS
05-08-2010, 06:40 AM
Like sweating it out?
.

I'm not sure if sweat glands work exactly the same way as diffusion across the larger "hide", as sweat glands are intended to "work fast". There is a lot of research on comparative "salt sensitivity" between black and white, some of it hilarious, such as suggestions that we only allowed blacks who didn't sweat to survive the slave passage or that we never allowed them food with calcium and magnesium, etc,...but the real issue seems to be racial differences in how easily the proper ratios are maintained.

.

Zed
05-08-2010, 06:03 PM
You should post some of the stuff, mate

FIPS
05-09-2010, 06:38 PM
You should post some of the stuff, mate
.

Strangely enough, some of the research suggests we also piss off certain salts better than blacks.


http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&rls=com.microsoft%3Aen-us%3AIE-SearchBox&q=%22racial+differences%22+%22salt+sensitivity%22+ sodium+calcium+magnesium+potassium&aq=o&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=